PBS WISCONSIN ORIGINAL PRODUCTION.

>> TO IMPROVE THE SERVICE THAT WISCONSINITES RECEIVE.

>> REPUBLICANS TAKE A VICTORY LAP.

AND JUST AS THE NEW FUNDING IS CUT OVER ITS DIVERSITY OFFICES, AFFIRMATIVE ACTION IN COLLEGE ADMISSIONS IS STRUCK DOWN BY THE U.S. SUPREME COURT.

>> I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.

FORMER GOVERNOR TOMMY THOMPSON SHARES HIS VISION FROM HIGHER EDUCATION.

AND POLITICAL TAKES ON BUDGET ACTION AT THE CAPITOL FROM PANELIST BILL McCOSHEN AND SCOT ROSS.

IT'S "HERE & NOW" ON JUNE 30th.

>> FUNDING FOR "HERE & NOW" IS FUNDED BY FRIENDS OF PBS WISCONSIN.

>> THE NEARLY 99 BILLION DOLLAR BIANNUAL STATE BUDGET FINISHED ITS JOURNEY THROUGH THE SENATE AND ASSEMBLY THIS WEEK PASSING ALONG PARTY LINES AND HEADS TO THE GOVERNOR'S DESK WHERE HE HAS PROMISED AN ABUNDANCE OF PARTIAL VETOES IF HE DOESN'T VETO THE BUDGET IN FULL.

REPUBLICANS HERALDED THE TAX CUTS AS A TRIUMPH WHILE DEMOCRATS ASSAILED THEM.

>> I'M INCREDIBLY PROUD OF THE DOCUMENT PRESENTED TODAY.

IT FOCUSES ON THE PRIORITIES WE HEARD AND KNOW WISCONSINITES WANTS.

IT'S ENSURING WE CAN AFFORD IT FOR THE LONG-TERM, MAKING SURE WE INVEST IN OUR PRIORITIES EVERYTHING FROM POLICE AND FIRE TO ENSURING WE HAVE GREAT SCHOOLS ACROSS THE STATE AND THEN ULTIMATELY RETURNING A SIGNIFICANT CHUNK, ALMOST HALF OF THE DOLLARS THAT WERE OVERTAKEN FROM THE CITIZENS OF WISCONSIN BACK TO THEM IN INCOME AND PROPERTY TAX CUTS.

>> TODAY I URGE MY GOP COLLEAGUES TO PROVIDE TARGETED TAX RELIEF TO THE MIDDLE-CLASS FAMILIES AND MAIN-STREET BUSINESSES WHO ARE THE BACK BONEBONE OF THE STATE OF WISCONSIN.

EVERY WISCONSINITE SHOULD KNOW REPUBLICANS ARE CHOOSING TO GIVE OUR STATE'S TOP ELEVEN EARNERS 20 MILLION DOLLARS IN TAX CUTS.

>> THE U.S. SUPREME COURT THIS WEEK CALLED AFFIRMATIVE ACTION OR CONSIDERATION OF A PERSON'S RACE IN COLLEGE ADMISSIONS UNCONSTITUTIONAL FOR VIOLATING THE EQUAL PROTECTION CLAUSE.

AFFIRMATIVE ACTION POLICIES HAVE EXISTED SINCE THE '60s AND CONSIDER A PERSON'S MINORITY RACE STATUS TO COUNTERACT.

THE RULING WILL REQUIRE MOD MODIFICAT MODIFICATIONS.

WE'LL ADAPT PRACTICES TO COMPLY WITH THE LAW.

AT THE SAME TIME I WANT TO REITERATE THAT OUR COMMITMENT TO THE VALUE OF DIVERSITY WITHIN OUR COMMUNITY INCLUDING RACIAL DIVERSITY REMAINS A BEDROCK VALUE OF THE INSTITUTION.

HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN THE STATE BUDGET GO TO HIGHER EDUCATION AND WITH LITTLE COORDINATION BETWEEN THE UW AND TECHNICAL COLLEGE SYSTEMS, WE ARE NOW AT A CROSSROADS.

THAT'S ACCORDING TO TOMMY THOMPSON, FORMER GOVERNOR AND FORMER UW SYSTEM PRESIDENT.

HE JOINS ME NOW AND THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> IT'S A PLEASURE TO BE WITH YOU, ALWAYS IS, AND I LOVE YOUR PROGRAM, I LOVE WHAT YOU DO AND THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR HAVING ME ON YOUR PROGRAM.

>> THANK YOU.

SO WITH 13 TWO-YEAR UW CAMPUSES AND 16 MAIN TECHNICAL COLLEGES IN WISCONSIN, WHAT ARE THE INEFFICIENCIES IN THAT?

>> WELL, THAT'S ONLY PART OF THE PROBLEM, WHAT YOU JUST OUTLINED.

WHEN YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THE UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN, IT'S GOT 13 CAMPUSES, BUT IT ALSO HAS 13 TWO-YEAR CAMPUSES.

SO IT'S GOT 26.

AND THE LOCATION SCHOOL HAS 16 MAIN CAMPUSES BUT 54 OTHER BRANCH CAMPUSES.

YOU HAVE 80 PLACES THAT TEACH HIGHER EDUCATION AND VOCATIONAL EDUCATION.

THERE'S NO COOPERATION, NO CONSIDERATION OF ONE TO THE OTHER.

THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT SYSTEMS.

ONE IS FUNDED BY THE TAXPAYERS OF THE STATE; ONE IS FUNDED BY THE PROPERTY TAXPAYERS AND THE COORDINATION IS SMALL.

THE POPULATION IS GOING DOWN AND 2026 IS A CLIFF.

AND NOBODY IS PLANNING WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO.

THAT'S WHY I'VE BEEN ADVOCATING FOR SOME TIME, THERE NEEDS TO BE A TASK FORCE TO STUDY THIS BECAUSE WE HAVE OVERDUPLICATION, TOO MANY BUILDINGS AND TOO MUCH EDUCATION FOR THE AMOUNT OF STUDENTS WE HAVE.

WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

BETTER TO DO IT NOW IN AN IMPARTIAL SYSTEMIC SMART WAY THAN WAITING UNTIL 2026 AND SAY, "OH MY LORD, WHAT DO WE DO?"

>>THE WRITING HAS BEEN ON THE WALL FOR YEARS.

NOW WESTBEND WANTS TO CONSOLIDATE.

IS IT YOUR SENSE THE REST OF THE TWO-YEAR CAMPUSES SHOULD MERGE WITH TECH CAMPUSES?

>> NOT NECESSARILY BUT THEY SHOULD COME TOGETHER AND SAY WHICH ONE IS THE STRONGEST.

ONE SHOULD BE A TECH SCHOOL.

MAYBE THEY SHOULD BE ALL COMMUNITY COLLEGES, I THINK.

I THINK THEY SHOULD COME TOGETHER AND ALLOW THE STUDENTS TO BE ABLE TO CHOOSE THE BEST COURSE FOR THEMSELVES AND GET MORE STUDENTS TO GRADUATE.

IT'S SORT OF A DEPLORABLE RECORD TO GET ALL THESE STUDENTS INTO COLLEGE AND THEY DON'T FINISH, BOTH AT THE UNIVERSITY AND EVEN MORE SO AT THE VOCATIONAL EDUCATION.

IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE TO ME AND IT DOESN'T HELP THE STUDENTS.

IT DOESN'T HELP THE WORKERS' PRODUCTIVITY OR GRADUATION RATES IN WISCONSIN.

WE HAVE OVERDUPLICATION.

WE HAVE SOME VOCATIONAL SCHOOLS AND TWO-YEAR CAMPUSES SHARING THE SAME PARKING LOT, THE SAME CLASSROOMS, AND YET THEY HAVE TWO DIFFERENT SYSTEMS.

DOES THAT MAKE ANY SENSE TO ANYBODY WHEN THE DECLINING POPULATION IN BOTH SYSTEMS ARE VYING FOR THAT STUDENT?

WHY DON'T WE PUT ALL OF THESE INTO A COMMUNITY COLLEGE AND PUT THEM IN AND DECIDE HOW MANY WE REALLY NEED?

>> WHAT ABOUT KIND OF LOCALIZED SENSE OF PRIDE AND OWNERSHIP OF HAVING A UW CAMPUS FOR STUDENTS WHO CAN GO ON TO GET THEIR FOUR-YEAR AGREE AT THE CORRESPONDING CAMPUS?

>> IT'S WONDERFUL BUT THE PROBLEM IS YOU CAN'T AFFORD IT AND THAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED IN RICHLAND CENTER.

IT'S BEING CLOSED DOWN.

NOW THE COUNTY OF RICHLAND, WHICH IS A POOR COUNTY, HAS GOT TO TAKE CARE OF THE BUILDINGS AND THEY'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE CLASSES NEXT YEAR.

AND SO THE PEOPLE IN RICHLAND CENTER ARE VERY UPSET.

BUT YOU HAVE A VOCATIONAL SCHOOL DOING VERY WELL.

WOULDN'T IT MAKE SENSE, I MEAN, JUST COMMON SENSE TO SAY WHY DON'T THE TWO COME TOGETHER AND HAVE COURSES SO THAT THE STUDENTS CAN HAVE SOME COURSES IN THE RICHLAND CENTER SO THOSE BUILDINGS ARE BEING UTILIZED AND MAKE THOSE BOTH INTO A COMMUNITY COLLEGE?

DOWN IN WEST BEND, THEY HAD THE UNIVERSITY DECLINING IN POPULATION BUT THE VOCATION SCHOOL IS DOING WELL.

SO THE COUNTY EXEC CAME UP WITH A BRILLIANT IDEA.

LET'S SEE WHAT WE CAN DO, STUDY AND PUT THEM TOGETHER.

THAT'S WHAT HAS TO HAPPEN.

BUT WE SHOULD BE DOING THIS STATEWIDE.

WE SHOULDN'T WAIT UNTIL THIS CATACLYSMIC DECLINE THAT'S COMING IN 2026 AND EVERYBODY IS SAYING, "WHY DIDN'T WE DO SOMETHING?"

TIME IS NOW.

IT WAS YESTERDAY, BUT TODAY LET'S GET STARTED AND NOT WASTE ANY MORE TIME.

>> SO WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE LEGISLATIVE BUDGET WRITERS CUTTING 32 MILLION DOLLARS FROM THE UW AND TARGETING ITS DIVERSITY, EQUITY, AND INCLUSION OFFICES?

>> WELL, I THINK, YOU KNOW, THAT WHEN YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THE AFFIRMATIVE ACTION OPINION THAT CAME OUT OF THE SUPREME COURT THIS WEEK, IT'S OBVIOUS THAT MAYBE THE UNIVERSITY HAS GOT TO COME TO GRIPS WITH THE FACT THAT THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO WORK WITH THE LEGISLATURE.

I'M NOT SAYING ONE SIDE IS RIGHT AND THE OTHER SIDE IS WRONG, BUT I'M SAYING COOPERATION AND LEADERSHIP AND DISCUSSION IS WHAT IS NEEDED AND I DON'T CARE THERE'S ENOUGH OF THAT.

>> AS THE FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE SYSTEM, WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE VALUE OF THOSE DEI OFFICES?

>> WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOW MANY, I THINK THAT, I THINK THE UNIVERSITY HAS GONE, HAS GOT PROBABLY TOO MANY POSITIONS AND I THINK THE LEGISLATURE IS SAYING, "YES, YOU HAVE TOO MANY POSITIONS.

YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF STUDENTS IN WISCONSIN AS WELL."

WE'VE GOT TO MAKE SURE THE UNIVERSITY IS WELL-FUNDED AND ABLE TO RECRUIT ENOUGH STUDENTS AND THE UNIVERSITY IS PLANNING AHEAD AND LOOKING AT THESE PROBLEMS AND FINDING WAYS TO, YOU KNOW, TO SOLVE THEM, AND THEY'VE GOT TO LEARN TO WORK WITH THE LEGISLATURE.

>> WHO DO YOU THINK SHOULD TAKE THE CHARGE?

>> I THINK IT'S GOT TO BE THE BOARD OF REGENTS, THE PRESIDENTS' DAY -- THE PRESIDENT, AND THE GOVERNOR.

THEY HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO SET IT UP AND HAVE AN INDEPENDENT STUDY.

I THINK WE SHOULD SIT DOWN WITH THE VOCATION SCHOOL AND THE UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN TWO-YEAR CAMPUSES AND COME UP WITH WAYS OF HOW TO TURN THEM INTO COMMUNITY COLLEGES AND BE ABLE TO MEET THE NEEDS OF WISCONSIN.

WISCONSIN HAS GOT TO BE MORE GRADUATES AND MORE STUDENTS PREPARED TO WORK, MORE STUDENTS EDUCATED IN THE JOBS THAT WE HAVE AND ARE GOING.

WISCONSIN IS GROWING AND WE DON'T HAVE THE EXPERTISE REALLY TO PILOT THE PROGRAMS AND THE JOBS THAT ARE OUT THERE.

>> TOMMY THOMPSON, THANKS VERY MUCH.

>> MY PLEASURE.

>> YOU CAN WATCH OUR FULL-LENGTH INTERVIEW WITH TOMMY THOMPSON BY VISITING OUR WEBSITE AT PBS WISCONSIN DOT-ORG/NEWS.

TURNING TO ELECTIONS, THE JOB SECURITY OF THE ADMINISTRATOR OF THE WISCONSIN ELECTIONS COMMISSION IS UNCERTAIN AS OFFICIALS DELIBERATE THE FINE PRINT OF HER APPOINTMENT.

MEAGAN WOLFE'S FOUR-YEAR TENURE HAS WEATHERED THE CHAOS OF HOLDING ELECTIONS AMIDST A PANDEMIC AND NUMEROUS COURT CASES ALLEGING VOTER FRAUD IN THE 2020 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION BUT IS NOW IN THE CROSSHAIRS FOR SENATE REPUBLICANS WHO TYPICALLY APPROVE NOMINEES FOR THE JOB.

THE WISCONSIN ELECTIONS COMMISSION VOTED ON WOLFE'S REAPPOINTMENT.

THE COMMISSION'S THREE REPUBLICANS VOTED IN FAVOR BUT THE THREE DEMOCRATS ABSTAINED SAYING WOLFE DOESN'T NEED TO BE REAPPOINTED; SHE SHOULD MAINTAIN HER CURRENT ROLE UNTIL THERE IS A VACANCY.

>> THANK YOU TO THE COMMISSIONERS FOR THEIR KIND WORDS AND THEIR UNANIMOUS SUPPORT FOR ME JOB PERFORMANCE TODAY.

I WAS SO IMPRESSED BY THE COMMISSIONERS' INTEGRITY AND WILLING TO STAND UP FOR THE TRUTH ABOUT ELECTIONS, TO SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT ABOUT THE OUR PROCESS AND HOW THE COMMISSION WORKS AND HOW THE COMMISSION'S DECISIONS, WHICH I DON'T HAVE A VOTE ON, HOW THEY'RE MADE, DELIBERATED AS PART OF A PUBLIC MEETING.

>> I THINK THE STATUTORY LAW REGARDING THE WEC IS CRYSTAL CLEAR, AS CLEAR AS IT CAN BE.

I'M A BATTERED VETERAN OF I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY COURT CASES BEING APPOINTED IN 2016.

IF SOMEONE IS GOING TO SUE US, THEY'RE GOING TO SUE US AND WE'LL SEE HOW THAT SHAKES OUT, BUT I FEEL VERY CONFIDENT IN OUR INTERPRETATION OF THE LAW.

>> I'M VERY CONCERNED THAT NOW WE ARE LEAVING THE JOB OF THE ADMINISTRATOR IN THE HANDS OF A CIRCUIT COURT JUDGE OR COURT OF THE APPEALS IN THE SUPREME COURT AND HER POSITION COULD BE IN JEOPARDY ON A MOMENT'S NOTICE.

AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S GOOD FOR THE STAFF, I DON'T THINK THAT'S GOOD FOR THE ADMINISTRATION OF ELECTIONS IN WISCONSIN.

>> WITH ELECTION 2024 ALREADY HEATING UP, THE LATEST STATEWIDE POLLING ON CANDIDATES, SITTING POLITICIANS AND ISSUES TAKES THE PUBLIC TEMPERATURE IN WISCONSIN.

THE NEW MARQUETTE LAW SCHOOL POLL FINDS SOME INTERESTING RESULTS.

HERE TO TALK ABOUT IT, POLL DIRECTOR CHARLES FRANKLIN.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

THE APPROVAL RATING JUMP IS INTERESTING.

>> IT'S QUITE A JUMP.

>> 57 PERCENT OF RESPONDENTS PROVE OF THE JOB HE'S DOING WHILE 38 PERCENT DISAPPROVE AND HIS APPROVAL RATING HAS GONE UP 11 POINTS SINCE THE LAST ELECTION.

WHAT IN YOUR MIND EXPLAINS THIS?

>> TWO THINGS.

YOU'RE IN THE HEAT OF AN ELECTORAL BATTLE AND HE'S HAD A PRETTY GOOD LEGISLATIVE SESSION.

HE CERTAINLY HASN'T GOT MOST OF WHAT HE WANTED BUT HE'S GOTTEN A FAIR BIT OF WHAT HE WANTED.

SO I THINK THE SPRING HAS BEEN FAIRLY GOOD.

IT'S ALSO STRIKING THAT HE'S THE ONE PERSON WHO'S REALLY HAD THIS SUBSTANTIAL RISE IN APPROVAL SINCE OCTOBER.

OTHER RISES ARE MUCH MORE MODEST.

SO I THINK WE HAVE TO GIVE CREDIT TO HIM.

>> ON THE OTHER HAND, YOUR POLL SAYS 40 PERCENT SAY IT'S GOING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

COULD THAT BE SOMETHING OTHER THAN TONY EVERS?

>> I THINK WE'RE SEEING THAT USED TO BE A MEASURE OF HOW GOOD A JOB THE INCUMBENT'S DOING, BUT NOW IF YOU'RE A DEMOCRAT YOU BLAME REPUBLICANS FOR WHY WE'RE HEADED OFF IN THE WRONG DIRECTION AND IF YOU'RE REPUBLICANS YOU BLAME THE DEMOCRATS FOR THE SAME THING.

THERE'S A LOT OF ACROSS THE AISLE POINTING.

WE SEE IN THE NATIONAL AND STATE NUMBERS.

IT DOESN'T MEAN WHAT IT USED TO MEAN ABOUT WHETHER THINGS ARE GOOD OR BAD.

>> IN THE GOP PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY, AMONG REPUBLICANS AND THOSE WHO LEAN REPUBLICAN WHEN ACCOUNTING FOR ALL THE GOP CANDIDATES OUT THERE IT'S EVEN BETWEEN DONALD TRUMP AND RON DESANTIS, 31 PERCENT AND 30 PERCENT.

WITH 21 PERCENT UNDECIDED, THAT SEEMS LIKE A BIG NUMBER.

WHEN ASKED WHO THEY WOULD PICK WHEN ONLY BETWEEN THOSE TWO, 57 PERCENT CHOSE DeSANTIS OVER 41 PERCENT FOR TRUMP.

WHAT DO ALL THESE NUMBERS SAY?

>> WELL, FIRST OF ALL, IT'S REALLY SURPRISING BECAUSE IN NATIONAL POLLING TRUMP IS LEADING DeSANTIS BY AT LEAST DOUBLE DIGITS AND THAT'S BEEN PRETTY CONSISTENT INCLUDING IN OUR NATIONAL POLLING.

I WAS SURPRISED BY THAT NUMBER.

BUT WHAT WE SEE IS THAT OF THE PEOPLE THAT WOULD LIKE SOMEBODY OTHER THAN DeSANTIS OR TRUMP OR ARE UNDECIDED, THEY GO 65 TO 75 PERCENT TO DeSANTIS WHEN YOU ASK THE HEAD TO HEAD QUESTION.

ONLY ABOUT A QUARTER OF THEM MOVE TO TRUMP.

TRUMP IS GETTING A LOT OF SUPPORT FROM HIS BASE WITHIN THE PARTY BUT OF THE 30 PERCENT OF REPUBLICANS THAT DON'T LIKE TRUMP, HE GOT ZERO PERCENT ON THE HEAD-TO-HEAD QUESTION.

SO IT'S NOT, YOU KNOW, THOSE THAT LIKE HIM STILL LIKE HIM QUITE A BIT BUT THERE IS THIS SEGMENT, A MINORITY OF 30 PERCENT, THAT REALLY DON'T LIKE TRUMP AND ARE LOOKING FOR ANY ALTERNATIVE.

>> SO AS FOR EITHER OF THE TWO FRONTRUNNING REPUBLICAN CANDIDATES FOR PRESIDENT, YOUR POLL SHOWED A CLOSE MATCH-UP BETWEEN JOE BIDEN AND DeSANTIS WITH 4 PERCENT UNDECIDED IN THE HYPOTHETICAL MATCH-UP BETWEEN BIDEN, HE DOES MUCH BETTER AGAINST TRUMP, 52 PERCENT TO 43 PERCENT.

SO AS A CANDIDATE, DONALD TRUMP HAS SOME WORK TO DO IN THIS IMPORTANT SWING STATE.

>> YES, I THINK THAT IS CERTAINLY THE CASE AND IT GOES PARTLY TO THE ELECTABILITY ARGUMENT.

IT ALSO GOES TO THE FACT THAT TRUMP IS STILL GETTING 94 AND 95 PERCENT OF THE REPUBLICAN VOTE WHEN HE'S MATCHED UP AGAINST BIDEN.

DeSANTIS GETS ALMOST EXACTLY THE SAME REPUBLICAN SUPPORT THERE.

SO IT'S NOT REPUBLICANS DESERTING TRUMP AT ALL.

WHAT IT IS, IS THE INDEPENDENTS WHO LEAN A LITTLE BIT TO BIDEN VERSUS DeSANTIS AND MOVE HEAVILY TO BIDEN WHEN IT'S TRUMP.

IT'S WINNING YOUR PRIMARY WITH A LOT OF TRUE BELIEVERS BUT MOVING ON TO A GENERAL ELECTION YOU NEED TO APPEAL TO INDEPENDENTS.

AND AT LEAST THIS MONTH IN THIS SAMPLE, TRUMP IS DOING NOTICEABLY WORSE WITH INDEPENDENTS THAN DeSANTIS IS.

REMEMBER, WE ARE IN THE FIELD THE DAY AND FOLLOWING THE INDICTMENT OF TRUMP.

DIDN'T HURT HIM WITH REPUBLICANS BUT IT MAY BE THAT THAT'S PART OF WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THESE INDEPENDENTS AND LOOKING AHEAD TO THE GENERAL.

>> INTERESTING CONTEXT.

SO AS FOR SITTING U.S.

SENATOR TAMMY BALDWIN, ALSO UP FOR RE-ELECTION, HER FAVORABILITY RATING TICKED UP 3 POINTS FROM LAST OCTOBER, NOW SITTING AT 40 PERCENT FAVORABLE, 37 PERCENT UNFAVORABLE BUT 22 PERCENT HAVE NOT HEARD ENOUGH ABOUT HER.

SHE MUST STILL BE FORMIDABLE THOUGH BECAUSE NOBODY HAS FORMALLY DECLARED AGAINST HER.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

THAT'S 22 PERCENT IS IN LINE WITH WHERE SHE HAS BEEN THE LAST TWO OR THREE YEARS.

RON JOHNSON IS USUALLY IN THE 30s.

THOUGH WHEN ELECTIONS COME YOU GET THAT NUMBER DOWN TO 10 PERCENT THAT DON'T KNOW ENOUGH.

IT'S A BIG ELECTION EFFECT.

WHEN WE ASKED ABOUT FOUR POTENTIAL REPUBLICAN CHALLENGERS BETWEEN 50 AND 85 PERCENT DIDN'T KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT ANY OF THOSE.

UNTIL SOMEBODY OFFICIALLY GETS IN AND THE RACE HEATS UP AND THEY'RE CAMPAIGNING, NO CHALLENGER IS GOING TO LOOK VERY GOOD ON THE NAME RECOGNITION SIDE AND IN PERSPECTIVE BALDWIN HAS A LITTLE ADVANTAGE OF BEING WELL KNOWN BUT THE CHALLENGERS WHEN THEY DO GET IN WILL BUILD RECOGNITION OVER THE NEXT 18 MONTHS.

>> ALL RIGHT, CHARLES FRANK, THANKS VERY MUCH FOR YOUR WORK.

>> THANK YOU.

>> AS ALWAYS THERE'S A LOT GOING ON IN WISCONSIN FROM POLITICS TO POLICY.

TONIGHT WE CHECK IN WITH OUR POLITICAL PANELIST REPUBLICAN BILL McCOSHEN AND DEMOCRAT SCOT ROSS.

THANKS FOR BEING HERE.

FIRST OFF WHAT IS YOUR BROAD TAKE ON THE LEGISLATURE'S STATE BUDGET JUST PASSED AND AWAITING THE GOVERNOR'S ACTION?

IS IT WHAT YOU EXPECTED WITH A 7 BILLION DOLLAR SURPLUS?

>> I THINK IT'S A 7 BILLION DOLLAR WASTED OPPORTUNITY BY REPUBLICANS TO SUPPORT THINGS THAT ARE GOING TO HELP THE PEOPLE OF WISCONSIN, MEN, WOMEN, CHILDREN, THRIVE AND EXCEL.

WE MISSED THE OPPORTUNITY TO END THE CRIMINAL ABORTION BAN.

WE'RE GASHING THE UW SYSTEM.

WE'RE NOT FULLY FUNDING PUBLIC EDUCATION.

LET'S JUST TALK ABOUT CHILDCARE.

WE'VE GOT CHILDCARE, THERE WAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO PROVIDE REAL CHILDCARE BUT INSTEAD WE'RE GIVING A TAX BREAK TO THE TOP 1 PERCENT.

25,000 PEOPLE ARE GETTING THE 300 MILLION DOLLARS THAT COULD HAVE OTHERWISE PREVENTED 2500 CHILDCARE FACILITIES FROM CLOSING THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS.

IT'S JUST SHAMEFUL.

>> I THINK VIEWERS SHOULD BE EXCITED ABOUT THIS BUDGET.

THIS IS TONY'S THIRD BUDGETS WITH REPUBLICANS IN THE MAJORITY WHERE THEY HAVE GRAND BARGAINS ON KEY ISSUES.

SHARED REVENUE, HISTORIC INCREASE IN FUNDING TO LOCAL GOVERNMENT, K-12 AND CHARTER SCHOOLS, ALL KIDS BENEFIT REGARDLESS OF WHICH CHOICE THEIR PARENTS MAKE FOR THEIR EDUCATION, HOUSING 500 MILLION DOLLARS, TO INCREASE THE HOUSING STOCK NOT ONLY IN URBAN BUT RURAL AREAS AS WELL.

LITERACY, TRANSPORTATION, PAY RAISES FOR STATE EMPLOYEES.

ALL OF THOSE THINGS THEY AGREED ON.

THAT'S THE FIRST TIME THAT'S HAPPENED IN THE LAST THREE BUDGETS.

I THINK THERE'S A LOT TO BE EXCITED ABOUT IN THIS BUDGET.

>> WHAT DO YOU THINK THE GOVERNOR MIGHT DO?

>> I TALKED TO SOMEBODY TODAY FROM THE EAST WING AND THEY SAID THE CHANCE OF VETOING THE ENTIRE BUDGET ARE FIFTY-FIFTY.

IF NOT THEY'RE GOING TO LINE ITEM AS MUCH AS HUMANLY POSSIBLE AS THE GOVERNOR ALREADY STATED AND I THINK FOR GOOD REASON BECAUSE WE MISSED OPPORTUNITIES, HANDING OUT TOO MUCH MONEY TO PEOPLE.

>> WHAT WOULD HE BE VETOING OVER?

>> THE TAX PLAN IN PARTICULAR.

YOU SEE HOW MUCH MONEY THEY'RE WASTING.

THE TOP 1 PERCENT IS TAKING AWAY 300 PLUS BILLION DOLLARS.

IF YOU GET RID OF THAT TOP RATE IT'S 700 MILLION DOLLARS LOST THAT COULD BE INVESTED IN THINGS LIKE CHILDCARE.

>> THREE CHOICES, SIGN IT IN TOTAL, HE WON'T DO THAT, VETO IT COMPLETELY, I DON'T THINK THAT'S REALISTIC, OR PARTIAL VETOES IS REALISTIC.

HIS STAFF INDICATED HE WILL USE IT AS MUCH AS HUMANLY POSSIBLE.

THE REASON HE WON'T VETO THE WHOLE BILL, THE FUNDING IS IN THIS BILL.

THE LIKELIHOOD OF A BETTER DEAL NEXT TIME AROUND IS ZERO.

>> TO ELIMINATE UW DEI OFFICES.

BUT WHAT'S NEXT IN THE REALM OF ABANDONING DIVERSITY, EQUITY, AND INCLUSION INITIATIVES IN WISCONSIN?

>> I DON'T THINK WE'RE ABANDONING IT BUT I THINK MAYBE FINALLY WE'RE GOING TO PUT THE FOCUS WHERE IT BELONGS WHICH IS ON URBAN SCHOOLS.

IF YOU WANT TO GIVE AFRICAN-AMERICAN KIDS A BETTER OPPORTUNITY YOU HAVE TO TEACH THEM TO READ.

WHEN 22 CAN READ AT GRADE LEVEL AND 80 PERCENT CAN'T, THE 80 PERCENT IS NEVER GOING TO MAKE IT TO COLLEGE AND MORE LIKELY TO END UP IN PRISON.

THAT HAS TO BE THE FOCUS IS MAKING SURE OUR URBAN SCHOOLS DELIVER THE KIND OF EDUCATION THOSE KIDS NEED AND THE TRUTH IS THE ONES WHO SUFFER THE MOST ARE ASIAN AMERICANS, NOT WHITES.

>> I THINK IT'S DISGRACEFUL WHAT THE SUPREME COURT AND REPUBLICAN LEGISLATURE IS TRYING TO DO.

AGAIN, DIVERSITY IS WHAT MAKES WISCONSIN, WHAT MAKES THE UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN GREAT, AND STYMYING THAT BECAUSE YOU THINK IT PLAYS YOUR RACIST BASE IS NOT THE WAY TO GO.

34 MILLION DOLLARS CUT OUT OF UW.

SO A STUDENT WHO GRADUATED FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA GETS TO WALK AFTER FOUR YEARS ACROSS THE AISLE.

A STUDENT AT THE UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN WILL HAVE TO STAY FIVE YEARS BECAUSE THEY CAN'T GET WHAT THEY NEED IN FOUR YEARS AS A RESULT.

>> MY SON GRADUATED FROM MADISON IN MAY.

I WAS AT THE GRADUATION CEREMONY.

FEWER THAN 200 AFRICAN-AMERICANS CROSSED THE STAGE OUT OF 8,000.

>> WE HAVE TO DOUBLE DOWN AND NOT TAKE IT BACK.

WHAT THE SUPREME COURT DID WAS DISGRACEFUL AND PROBABLY WAS THE WORST WEEK FOR THE SUPREME COURT OTHER THAN PLESSENGER VERSUS FERGUSON.

>> SPEAKING OF THE SUPREME COURT, THEY TURNED BACK JOE BIDEN'S ACTION TO CANCEL STUDENT LOAN DEBT.

WHAT IS THE COMPLIIMPLICATIONS?

>> I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW PROVIDING ROBIN VOS WITH A 300,000 LOAN, HE'S A MULTI-MILLIONAIRE, HOW THAT HELPS THE ECONOMY, BUT FORGIVING 10,000 DOLLARS FOR NEARLY A MILLION STUDENT LOAN BORROW ERS WHO WILL PUT IT BACK IN THE ECONOMY HELPS OUR ECONOMY.

IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

AND THE PEOPLE WHO FINANCED THE LAWSUIT GOT A PPP LOAN.

IT'S HYPOCRISY.

>> I'M ONE OF SEVEN KIDS.

THE NOTION THAT I WOULD GO TO A BIG TEN SCHOOL AND GET A DEGREE WAS UNTHINKABLE WHEN I WAS A KID, YET IT HAPPENED.

WHY?

I INVESTED IN MYSELF.

I TOOK OUT STUDENT LOANS.

I PAID THOSE BACK.

I VIEWED IT AS AN INVESTMENT IN MYSELF AND I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO PAY FOR SOMEONE ELSE WHO MADE THAT SAME CHOICE.

>> THAT'S THE ARGUMENT.

>> WE SPENT THE MONEY, WE USED TO INVEST TEN CENTS OF EVERY GPR DOLLAR INTO HIGHER GENERAEDUCAT.

IT'S DOWN TO TWO AND A HALF CENTS.

I PAID STUDENT DEBT FOR 26 YEARS.

I SUPPORT FORGIVING EVERY PENNY OF STUDENT LOAN DEBT AND MAKE IT FREE.

>> I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT THE MARQUETTE LAW SCHOOL POLL THAT SHOWED 66 PERCENT OF PEOPLE SURVEYED IN WISCONSIN THINK ABORTION SHOULD BE LEGAL IN ALL OR MOST CASES.

HOW WILL THIS ISSUE CONTINUE TO INFORM THE UPCOMING ELECTIONS?

>> THE SUPREME COURT OF WISCONSIN HAS A BIG SAY IN THAT WHETHER IT'S THE LAW OF THE LAND OR SOMETHING PASSED SUBSEQUENT TO THAT.

SO WE'LL SEE.

IF YOU LOOK CLOSELY AT THE CROSS TABS PEOPLE DON'T LIKE ABORTION UP UNTIL THE TIME OF BIRTH AND A LOT OF FOLKS DON'T SUPPORT ANY ABORTION AT ANY TIME.

>> NOBODY'S HAVING ABORTIONS UP TO THE POINT OF BIRTH BUT I AGREE IT'S GOING TO BE A HUGE ISSUE.

I THINK IT'LL REIGN HUGE IN RACES AND DEMOCRATS ARE ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF HISTORY.

THE LESSON FROM THE POLL IS REPUBLICANS IF THEY ACTED MORE LIKE DEMOCRATS WITH THOSE ISSUES THEY MIGHT LOSE FEWER ELECTIONS.

>> FOR MORE ON THIS AND OTHER ISSUES FACING WISCONSIN VISIT OUR WEBSITE AND PBS WISCONSIN DOT-ORG AND CLICK ON THE NEWS TAB.

THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR TONIGHT.

I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.

HAVE A GOOD WEEKEND.

(CLOSED CAPTIONING PROVIDED BY RIVERSIDE CAPTIONING COMPANY) >> FUNDING FOR "HERE & NOW" IS PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS WISCONSIN.